Recruiting Your Sales Rockstar: Finding the Right Sales Manager

Dennis Collins: 00:00:13

Hello everyone.

Dennis Collins: 00:00:14

It's Dennis and Leah and hi Leah.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:00:19

Hey Dennis.

Dennis Collins: 00:00:19

Welcome back for another episode of Connect & Convert

Dennis Collins: 00:00:23

brought to you by the Wizard Academy.

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Here's where you learn insider secrets.

Dennis Collins: 00:00:30

To help small business owners grow sales faster than ever.

Dennis Collins: 00:00:34

Hey, Leah, today, this is a topic I get a lot of questions about this.

Dennis Collins: 00:00:39

Maybe you've had some concerns and questions.

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What do you want from your next sales manager?

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You're a small business owner, okay?

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And all of a sudden, it becomes obvious you need to hire a new sales manager.

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Maybe the incumbent isn't working out.

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Maybe you've never had a sales manager.

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What should you be looking for?

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Okay, the sales manager position, we've all worked for sales managers.

Dennis Collins: 00:01:07

Some of us have been sales managers.

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This is one of the most crucial, and I think probably the least appreciated

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job in the building sometimes.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:01:17

The dreaded middle manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:01:19

Yeah.

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The sandwich manager you're in between you are caught.

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The sales manager is caught in between the boss or the owner, of course, who you work

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for and the clients who you also work for.

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And of course your salespeople, you're caught right in the middle.

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I call it the pressure cooker.

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So Leah, I.

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I just wondered, you've, worked for probably a lot

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of different sales managers.

Dennis Collins: 00:01:48

I have.

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I have been a sales manager.

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Why do you think we so often as small business owners make mistakes

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about hiring sales managers?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:01:58

I think a lot of the time it's because we don't really

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:00

understand the role that we're hiring for.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:03

You're giving up a lot of control if you've never had a sales manager before

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and suddenly you're going to have someone that's going to be liaisoning

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between what you want to do and what you want your business, your your

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:14

salespeople to do for your customers.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:16

And then, and it's that dreaded, are you hiring yourself?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:22

You're hiring somebody with skills that are different than yours.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:25

I always believe in reverse engineering this.

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I have had sales managers that I love.

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I have had sales managers that honestly.

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It was a terrible experience.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:37

So what made it that way?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:02:38

And the people that hired them, why did they have me working for these people?

Dennis Collins: 00:02:43

Yep, that's the question that a lot of business owners are asking.

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And you put a point on it.

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So let's, help our listeners try to understand this.

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Sometimes you can learn about what you should do by learning

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the things that you should not do.

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So I'm sure, Leah, as I go through this, you will have some examples some thoughts

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about some of these and chime in please.

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First of all, seven things that you should not do as a small business owner when

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you're trying to hire a new sales manager.

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Number one, don't rely solely on just resumes.

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Interview deeply.

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How about don't underestimate the importance of EQ.

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What is EQ?

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We know what IQ is.

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EQ is emotional intelligence.

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Okay?

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The ability to listen, to collaborate, to lead.

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Is that, how does that hit you, Leah, when you think about

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sales managers you've known?

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The EQ level.

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High, medium, or low.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:03:47

The emotion, the ability to connect with people,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:03:49

to not be above people, makes me think of a really good coach.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:03:53

Most people have had some experience with sports, either you've played it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:03:56

You've watched it on TV.

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Your kids have played it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:03:59

The coaches that really get the kids their, athletes are the

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ones that are connected with them and make them want to do more.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:04:08

They're not telling them to do more.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:04:10

They want to do more.

Dennis Collins: 00:04:13

Isn't that the essence of coaching?

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Truly.

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How about another don't do?

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Don't.

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Forget to take time to validate past performance, accomplishments, their

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responsibilities, their references.

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Boy, did I ever get burned on this.

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I had a guy that I hired as a sales manager.

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He had the best resume.

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He had all the pedigree.

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He had the education.

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And he documented on the resume a track record.

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I didn't do a particularly good job of verifying that information,

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and it came back to bite me.

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Unfortunately, he was not a capable person.

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He could not lead.

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He was not a leader.

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He looked like a leader.

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He talked like a leader, but his performance was not that of a leader.

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Did that ever hurt?

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That cost me time, money, aggravation, embarrassment.

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Go down the list.

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Right?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:05:16

It could even cost you a really good salesperson because

Leah Bumphrey: 00:05:19

honestly, yes, you've hired someone.

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And then they're ready to leave or they're not performing.

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They're upset and they pick that day to go feed the ducks because

Leah Bumphrey: 00:05:28

they're not working for this guy.

Dennis Collins: 00:05:31

It almost did.

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I had to save a couple of people, but costly mistake.

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Learn from my stupidity and mistakes.

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Don't do it.

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Don't do what I did in that case.

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I learned though.

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I never did that again.

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Another one, get multiple perspectives in the interview.

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I had a rule.

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In my radio stations, I call it a round of three.

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And what does that mean?

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Okay.

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So every possible candidate had to be in every viable candidate had to

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be interviewed by three managers.

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Okay.

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The hiring manager, the person who they were going to work for and

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two other managers on the team that they were not going to work for.

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Why perspective.

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So then we would all three meet.

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And we would talk about, okay, here's what I heard in every case, 100

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percent of the time, the other folks heard and saw something either good

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or bad that I, missed the round of three worked extremely well for me.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:29

I also once saw an interview process

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:32

and I was involved in it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:33

I wasn't being hired as a sales manager, but my spouse and I were interviewed

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:38

by the person I was going to be working for and you think, okay, that's kind of

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:41

weird, but really I was going to be in a position that was, it was going to be

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:46

important to know that it was supported, that who I was, what my life looked like.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:52

And although it was kind of strange for Sean at the time, it made a lot of sense.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:06:56

And this company kind of got away from that and then back to it, but it's always.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:02

Yeah.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:02

I mean, I would call this the round four of interviews.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:04

It's that, okay, how are they interacting with their spouse?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:08

Do they have their support?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:10

Is this a position that they're going to be able to move forward

Leah Bumphrey: 00:07:14

having a secure foundation at home?

Dennis Collins: 00:07:17

That's another twist.

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Boy, I never did that.

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Maybe I wish I had in some cases, but that's a great idea.

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Also here's one that sometimes slips by.

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The small business owner.

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Be aware of communication style mismatches.

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Now, what does that mean?

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We've done episodes here before on the four social styles, okay?

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Driver, analytical, expressive, and amiable, okay?

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And, I use this assessment, I just use it this week, I use it constantly.

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to discover a person's social styles.

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Why?

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So that we can understand how they process information.

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Now, you can't use that document as a pre hiring document because there's

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no right or wrong social style.

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It's difficult.

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It's, not really useful as a pre employment, but get an

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idea in the interview of, does their style match your team?

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If you have a high analytical, someone who's numbers oriented, data

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driven, and your team is expressive.

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Which is data averse.

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They hate data.

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That could be a mismatch.

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Unless there's high versatility.

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Okay.

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How about culture clashes, culture classes?

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You know, our producer Boomer is an expert in the area of company culture.

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One of these days we're going to have producer Boomer on this show as a

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guest to talk about business culture.

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Skill fit is important.

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Of course it is, but make sure they share your values.

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Your work style preferences, your overall business approach, that can be

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a big no no for a new sales manager.

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How about highly skilled top level salesperson?

Dennis Collins: 00:09:07

That's the best candidate for sales manager, right?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:11

Often not, often not it's a totally different skill set.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:16

And I'm not saying that someone can't be very good at selling and

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:18

also very good at managing, but wow, that's a hard double whammy.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:23

Then you have someone who's more even as a sales manager, more

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:27

selling versus more administrative.

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These are important designations to think about as you're looking at who you're

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going to be hiring because yes, you might have this fantastic team and this guy is

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:37

just blowing the numbers out of the park.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:40

But can he help other people do that?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:42

Is he someone that is willing to coach others or is it always

Leah Bumphrey: 00:09:45

about me?

Dennis Collins: 00:09:48

I have seen this happen in the radio industry.

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I was in the industry for decades and it was very common for the top salesperson

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to be promoted to sales manager.

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That was the next logical step in progression and 90 percent

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of the time it didn't work.

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You are so right.

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It's a different skill set from an individual contributor to a manager.

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It does not equate.

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Does that mean no one who's a top salesperson can do it?

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No.

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But be very careful.

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Don't be blinded by the fact that they're a top salesperson.

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That means they're a top sales manager.

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That kind of goes back to something we talked about, the

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halo effect, in a previous episode.

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Don't let that halo effect fool you, okay?

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So, okay, those are the things you shouldn't do.

Dennis Collins: 00:10:38

Hey, shouldn't we talk about the things you should do, Leah?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:10:41

Yes, let's be positive.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:10:42

Let's, let's look at that.

Dennis Collins: 00:10:44

Let's talk about seven things you should look for.

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Number one, you said it earlier, speak to this, if you will, coaching skills.

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What is the difference between teaching, mentoring and coaching?

Dennis Collins: 00:10:54

It's different.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:10:55

Absolutely.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:10:56

So when you're coaching you're, in there like a dirty shirt.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:00

Maybe on the, I'm thinking of hockey, you're on the ice

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:03

and you're you're doing it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:04

You are, have that ability to do it with your team, but teaching

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:09

is a little bit different.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:10

And when you think of teaching, okay, we always go back to the whiteboard.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:13

We go back to the, the handouts that that, teachers have.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:16

It's the ability to transfer knowledge.

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It's, there's this and away we go.

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You can teach something and not be able to do it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:23

You know, there's the old saying, you know, those who can,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:27

can't teach and then mentoring.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:30

Do you really care about your team?

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Are you able to put your arm around them and lead them to where they want to go?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:37

Now that's not always the fault of the mentor.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:40

Sometimes people don't want to be mentored.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:41

It's like, I know this already.

Dennis Collins: 00:11:43

Now.

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Some people don't want to be bothered,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:46

And that's where coaching comes in because if you have someone

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:48

that can't be taught is not wanting to be mentored, they're not in the student mold.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:52

And as a coach, you got to figure out pretty quick, do

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:55

they belong on the team or not?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:11:56

We see this happen in the the million dollar salaries with professional sports.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:12:01

And I go back to sports because to me, sales and sports are very closely aligned.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:07

I I love your distinction between the three,

Dennis Collins: 00:12:12

of all of those, I think the most misunderstood is the coaching.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:16

Okay.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:17

I look at a good coach as being someone who.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:21

Is not you can be a teacher and not a coach.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:24

You can be a mentor and not a coach.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:26

Okay, but a coach uses what's in you to bring out the best in you.

Dennis Collins: 00:12:33

Okay, they use what's in you They bring it out by asking questions Leah

Dennis Collins: 00:12:39

"What do you think you could have done differently on that sales call

Dennis Collins: 00:12:44

Something you could do the next time that would give you a better outcome?"

Dennis Collins: 00:12:48

that's the voice of a coach I'm not teaching you anything.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:12:52

A coach, it's, it's a trait that it doesn't matter if that person

Leah Bumphrey: 00:12:56

is, if it's one of their sales people.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:12:58

Okay.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:12:59

You're, hiring a coach to look after your sales team.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:02

But that person, if they have the trait of being a coach, when you see

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:05

them in other aspects of their life.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:08

There's someone who wants to make a difference.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:10

There's someone who wants to help.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:12

That will be for your team, but when they're talking to you, okay,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:16

are they just blowing sunshine or are they talking like a coach

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:20

when you look on their socials?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:22

Because man, if you're just looking at resumes and you're not

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:24

looking at what they're posting.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:25

What are they posting about?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:27

Are they coaching the people in their lives?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:30

Are they involved in other things?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:32

A coach is not something that you can teach.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:13:35

You are a coach or you're not.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:38

I, yeah, I think it's intuitive.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:40

I do.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:40

I agree with you.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:41

You can teach somebody coaching skills, but to have that inner

Dennis Collins: 00:13:45

coach, I think that's something that's more intuitive than learned.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:50

let's talk about another one of the things you should look for.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:53

How about exceptional one on one?

Dennis Collins: 00:13:56

Group and written communication skills.

Dennis Collins: 00:13:58

You know, every business is in the communications business.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:02

And if you hire a sales manager who can't communicate You've just hampered yourself.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:08

You've made a big mistake.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:09

So check their, communication skills.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:12

How about a strong understanding of sales process?

Dennis Collins: 00:14:15

That's, that kind of sounds like duh, but you'd be surprised how many

Dennis Collins: 00:14:20

sales managers get hired that don't understand the entire sales process

Dennis Collins: 00:14:25

from prospecting to closure and client retention after the sale and follow up.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:32

And that is critical.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:34

That is critical because, and again, let's look at this, a strong

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:37

understanding of the process.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:39

You're not saying a strong salesperson.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:41

Those are two different things.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:42

A lot of the best salespeople I've ever worked with had no idea how they

Leah Bumphrey: 00:14:45

were doing it, but to be able to teach, yeah, you've got to understand it.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:52

What do they call it at the Wizard Academy?

Dennis Collins: 00:14:53

Unconscious incompetence, something like that, or conscious incompetence

Dennis Collins: 00:14:58

and unconscious incompetence.

Dennis Collins: 00:14:59

Or unconscious competence.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:01

Or unconscious competence.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:03

Yes.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:03

Oh, crap.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:04

I'm getting these all mixed up, but they're, they're all, well, I know

Dennis Collins: 00:15:08

what you, that's another podcast.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:10

We'll do that.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:10

That's that.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:13

How about strategic thinkers?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:14

You know, sales managers that I hired back in the day, I, kind of

Dennis Collins: 00:15:20

required them to think strategically.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:23

What does that mean?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:23

Well, talk to me about how you're going to manage the accounts,

Dennis Collins: 00:15:27

our business, our clients.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:29

How about territories or account lists or whatever you have?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:33

How about pricing?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:34

Pricing management?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:35

That's critical strategic thinking.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:38

How about negotiation skills?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:39

How are you at negotiation?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:41

How about creative solutions to problems?

Dennis Collins: 00:15:44

The ability to establish and manage the key sales metrics.

Dennis Collins: 00:15:49

These are all strategic things that my new sales manager needs to do.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:15:54

But also when they're answering, sorry Dennis, but when

Leah Bumphrey: 00:15:58

they're answering that question, that also gives you some insight

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:00

into what kind of person are they?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:02

Because are they just plowing ahead with this is how they've always

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:06

done it, this is what they believe, this is what they're gonna do?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:09

Are they open to talking with their sales team?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:12

Are they open to your process?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:14

Are they willing to sit back and learn?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:17

Now, it depends where it is that you are in the hiring process, but what

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:21

you need is going to be revealed when they're talking or what you don't want

Leah Bumphrey: 00:16:26

is going to be revealed when they're explaining what their process is.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:29

And that's why we, interview deeply to find these things out.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:35

Let's round up the last three here.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:38

Solution focused.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:39

Okay.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:39

That I don't want a sales manager coming into my office with a problem.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:43

I want them coming in with a problem that has a solution that they have figured out.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:48

How about a winning record of performance?

Dennis Collins: 00:16:51

Yeah.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:51

Remember we talked about that earlier.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:53

Verify their track record.

Dennis Collins: 00:16:57

Verify the fact that they can grow revenue, work for previous

Dennis Collins: 00:17:01

employers, by managing a team.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:04

Not just themselves, but a team.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:06

And last, number seven, technical savvy.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:08

I don't think we can get around that this day and age.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:12

You've got to understand the technical part of the business.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:18

Understand data, understand how data is used to enhance sales,

Dennis Collins: 00:17:22

understand all things technology.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:25

So,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:26

and not be afraid of it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:28

You can't be afraid of it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:29

And that's part of being savvy.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:31

That's why we have Boomer, right?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:33

Because there's stuff that he knows and we know where to find that information.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:37

That's being savvy.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:38

It doesn't mean we have to know everything, but we have to be open

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:41

to asking and have someone to ask.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:43

Yeah, I'm afraid of it.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:47

You are not.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:17:48

You are not.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:49

Let's close this out with some pluses and minuses.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:52

Okay, let's, let's look at the upsides and downsides of

Dennis Collins: 00:17:54

getting that right sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:57

Let me start with the negatives.

Dennis Collins: 00:17:58

Unfortunately, the poor leadership, lack of direction for, from a poor

Dennis Collins: 00:18:04

sales manager, demoralize salespeople.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:06

They're going to leave.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:07

And I unfortunately had that happen.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:10

Remember, people fire their immediate boss, not the company.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:13

They fire their immediate boss.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:15

So, the negativity leads to increased attrition.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:20

The lack of accountability.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:23

I'm a big stickler on accountability.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:26

Who's responsible for what and when?

Dennis Collins: 00:18:28

Okay?

Dennis Collins: 00:18:29

That new that, sales manager who's not performing, who is not accountable, lacks

Dennis Collins: 00:18:35

direction, lacks a sense of urgency.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:37

Has low performance standards.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:39

That's going to not only not enhance your business, it's going to take it

Dennis Collins: 00:18:43

the other way in a downward direction.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:46

And the third, the third negative is inconsistent customer experience.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:51

Client management is uneven and reactive.

Dennis Collins: 00:18:55

How do we manage our clients?

Dennis Collins: 00:18:56

How do we retain our clients?

Dennis Collins: 00:18:59

Those are the three negatives.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:02

How about the positives?

Dennis Collins: 00:19:05

How about you're the boss, Leah.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:07

You own a business.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:10

And you're doing a DIY sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:12

You're doing a do it yourself sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:15

How does that work out for you?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:17

Here's the thing.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:18

You want to be a business owner.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:20

You don't want to be a job owner.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:22

That's the whole point of getting into business.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:24

So when you can find the right person.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:26

to delegate that kind of authority to, to help you grow your business,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:29

who's going to share your passion for what it is that you're doing.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:32

My goodness, you are freeing yourself up to actually work on your business,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:36

not work in your business, but work on it, make it grow faster, be able

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:41

to have a bird's eye view and trust the person that you're hiring.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:19:44

That is huge.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:47

That to me is one of the best points as to why you need to recruit

Dennis Collins: 00:19:51

that, that quality sales manager work.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:55

In your business, work on your business, not in your business.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:58

Well said.

Dennis Collins: 00:19:59

How about the sales manager is close if they're doing their

Dennis Collins: 00:20:02

job, a good sales manager can identify where we need improvement.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:06

One of the best ways, by the way, to grow your business is hiring

Dennis Collins: 00:20:10

that effective sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:11

That does grow business when you have an effective sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:15

And of course, make sure that you get the right blend.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:19

Sales leadership abilities.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:21

Strategic skills and people skills.

Dennis Collins: 00:20:24

Gosh, I think we just described the perfect person

Dennis Collins: 00:20:27

that doesn't exist out there.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:29

But you know what, there's nothing wrong

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:31

with having that perfect matrix.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:33

And then you weigh different things as you meet the individual, there are.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:37

It's surprising things about working for people.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:39

With people, there's always going to be that positive and that negative,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:42

but it can bring out incredible opportunities with your team.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:46

It can make them see parts of themselves they've never seen before,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:50

and it can make you see parts of your business you haven't before.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:52

It's all in the right person, because we've said it before, Dennis.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:20:58

Product, you can teach anybody product, but the type of person,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:02

that's what you're looking for.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:03

Do you trust them?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:05

Do you want to take them, spend time with them?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:07

Do you see them as someone who is as committed to your passion,

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:11

your business as you are?

Dennis Collins: 00:21:15

Well, again, that is so true.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:19

Easy to say, not easy to do, but give it a shot.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:23

Okay, I hope this has been helpful in guiding your thinking

Dennis Collins: 00:21:26

towards your new sales manager.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:28

Connect & Convert is brought to you by The Wizard Academy.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:34

I remember my first time ever going there, Leah, do you?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:37

Oh, absolutely.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:39

Absolutely.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:39

And you know what?

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:40

You learn and you get inspired and all of a sudden you see possibilities

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:44

that you never saw before.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:45

Wizardacademy.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:46

org.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:47

Check out the courses.

Leah Bumphrey: 00:21:48

They're phenomenal.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:50

It is transformational.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:52

Your brain will never be the same.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:54

You will think thoughts you have never thought before that can be instantly

Dennis Collins: 00:21:59

applied to yourself and to your business.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:01

Check them out.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:02

WizardAcademy.org.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:05

This concludes this episode of Connect & Convert.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:09

I hope we've given you some insider tips on how to improve your sales.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:15

We'll see you next time.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:16

For Leah, it's Dennis.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:18

Bye now.